persistence

Cold 3rd Party Leads

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I hate these.

We recently subscribed to Zillow in a small way. The closest actual area with leads available in it is about 30-35 minutes from my home. That’s where we did it.

I know the area okay, but it’s not my backyard. I’ve sold a couple/few houses over there, but there are parts of it I don’t know, and the surrounding towns are even more obscure for me.

That’s not what’s important though. What’s important is the quality of the lead.

I have friends who sell tons of shit and their primary lead source is Zillow. I’m not knocking it for them. But for me? Eh…

So, I got the Zillow call. It’s Saturday, 1:30 in the afternoon. I just finished lunch with my family and we’re literally walking out the door to go for a walk in the woods. Classic Zillow timing.

I try to actually not take the call because I was feeling very invested in spending time with my family and going on this walk.

They connected the lead to me anyway.

I texted the person because I was prompted to, saying that I was out and about, that today would not work, but that I would work on scheduling something when I was with my computer a little later. They said okay. Tomorrow after 2 would work for them.

I’m still reluctant. It’s gotta be tomorrow because it can’t be today, and I have the afternoon saved so my wife can go out with her friend while I stay with the kids. That’s not until 4. If I schedule this for 2, maybe I can get back in time to make it all work.

Zillow’s model is predicated on you being the appointment scheduler—the door opener. It degrades, at least initially, the role of the buyer agent to the most banal of examples of a real estate professional.

Can you tell it hurts my pride?

I get back and schedule the appointment. I reached back out to the buyer. I’d like to connect for a couple minutes on the phone before we show up at the house together.1 They don’t respond.

I wait a while (hours) and then text a question mark. They said something like, “Can’t talk now. Still good for tomorrow at 2?”

I replied that the appointment was scheduled, but that I like to jump on the phone, at least briefly, prior to the appointment so we can cover a few things.2

They didn’t respond.

I texted a while later that if it was easier for them to text, we could do that too. I asked whether they’d be using financing or cash to buy a home if they found one they liked.

Nothing.

I’m very reluctant to drive thirty minutes each way to show a condo anyway, not to mention to a cold lead, not to mention to an ice cold lead I’ve never spoken with, NOT TO MENTION an ice cold lead I’ve never spoken with who can’t seem to see any importance is humoring me with ten minutes on the phone.

Finally, I said that if we were not able to connect briefly to chat—whether via text or call—prior to the appointment, I was going to have to cancel it and I wouldn’t be able to help them.

They immediately texted me that they could talk.

They preferred texting.3 I asked whether this would be the first home they’d seen, or if they’d already been out to see some. They immediately texted and said that their agent was away tomorrow, and that’s why they needed me to show them the home. Their agent will be writing and submitting the offer, he just can’t show the house tomorrow.

Thank God.

I responded by thanking them profusely for telling me that, and telling them that I would be canceling the appointment, could not help them, and that they should ask their agent why if they felt confused.

I sent the email to cancel the Zillow subscription and to notify me when there’s availability closer to our office.

Bah humbug, and it’s not even October yet.

  1. I’ve only done two others in the last month or so. I’ve shown up at the house to meet them, and the listing agent in one case, and had established almost zero rapport prior to the appointment. I was tired of that because of how foreign it was to my process with warm leads. And I’ve always thought that agents who’ve done that when I’ve represented sellers in the past were weak, especially when they show up and the buyer doesn’t. Call me an asshole. It’s just not strong salesmanship or agency. ↩︎
  2. Qualify them so I don’t waste any more of my time. ↩︎
  3. This is also beginning to make me skeptical. I had an experience earlier this year where I listed a piece of raw land for someone who didn’t own it. It pays to be scrupulous with people these days—if it ever didn’t! ↩︎
Cold 3rd Party Leads

The Autopsy Report

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Something I learned from an excellent real estate coach named Brian Moses is the importance of reflecting on things that go well and things that don’t. The emphasis was on things that didn’t go well, but it can be applied to positive situations as well.

Brian talked about filling notebook after notebook with what he called “Autopsies.” He would autopsy situations after they were done, in writing, to learn what he could do better next time when the situation presented itself again.

This is based on the professional wisdom that at a certain point, situations we encounter in business aren’t really new. My father-in-law talked about this during his last visit with us. He spoke about how employees that come into his business fit into archetypes and he can predict how well they’ll turn out in many cases because he’s seen and hired and fired the same guy (not literally) before.

Whenever I have a deal die or I have a lead that I feel should have converted but didn’t or when I lose a listing appointment, I autopsy it.

In practice, this basically looks like journaling about the situation. But more specifically, I ask myself where I could have done better, where I was at fault. On further reflection, It’s usually evident where I messed up.

The one that comes to mind is a listing appointment from last summer. They were sort of an odd couple, around my age, and the house was a bit unusual. Mostly because there were something like a half-dozen or more cats living there. There was one bedroom of the five that was actually for the cats.

The people were nice enough. He was a bit more forward, she a bit more reserved. I quickly grew comfortable with them because of our closeness in age. We toured the home, sat at the table, and I went through my presentation. Prior to the presentation, I felt that we had established rapport. I especially felt that way with the man.

Well, I have the unfortunate habit of vulgar speech. It’s rarely a problem in my professional life, but it’s a character handicap inherited from my parents and perfected in the Marines that I’d rather not have. Because I felt especially comfortable with the man, and to a lesser degree with the woman but still comfortable, at some point I began speaking freely as I would with friends.

At the time, it felt pretty natural. There were no adverse reactions, and there may have even been some reciprocity.

I followed up a couple times as it was just a matter of time for them to list. Then one day, she told me that her friend recommended she work with someone and she decided to take her friend’s recommendation. She wasn’t bitter about it, and she was obviously forthcoming and didn’t just ignore me. I asked her point blank if there was something more I could have done to win her business, or, if there was anything I could have done better.

She paused and seemed to consider it, then convincingly said, “No.”

I was a little pissed about the situation. It was in the bag. $12k, gone.

Of course, I hung up congenially enough. But I was hurting.

I thought of Brian. So, I opened a Word doc and wrote through it. It was informative for me. Similar to seeking direction the way I described in yesterday’s post, this is a way that I can uncover stuff that’s holding me back, stuff that I otherwise won’t notice that I’m coming up against.

Here’s the Autopsy Report below as an example:

Autopsy Report
 
(The Person’s Name Was Here)

I interviewed for the listing and she said she was going to clean the house and paint and get her shit out before listing in about a month. I followed up with her after 1 week via text saying, “Just checking in with you. Were you able to connect with Attorney _______ about the capital gains tax question?” She responded saying that she hadn’t had a chance to call him but would hopefully by the end of the week. I asked if she had any other questions or things I could assist with. She said, “No not yet. I’m working on packing and cleaning/painting.”
 
I followed up again two weeks later on 6/21/22 asking her how the painting was going. She responded “Hi, I’m doing good. I’ve just decided to go with a realtor that a friend of mine just used, but thank you for your time and advice.”
 
I asked her if there were any other differentiators besides her friend’s recommendation that helped her decide. She said no, it was just the recommendation.
 
Damn!
 
I could have communicated more often. I let two weeks slip by before I reached back out again. By then it was too late. How do I continue to add value while seller leads are in nurture mode? I didn’t establish sufficient trust for her anyway. I won over the boyfriend, but I didn’t win her over.
 
I swore profusely while I presented to them because I felt comfortable. That was a mistake.
 
My communication is limited to texts and emails on Tuesdays. While that’s a step in the right direction as far as what I’ve otherwise done previously (structure), it’s not a very upbeat rhythm. I need to increase communication, but do it systematically.
 
What else can I do to add value and help to build trust with sellers? Brian would say that I should have left with the client docs signed. Some of these sellers aren’t ready to sign though. I stumbled a little through the presentation too I remember because the listing sheets were the CloudCMA listing sheets and I wasn’t familiar with where some of the details are located on the page. I need to know them like I know my phone number. Even if there was some other factor, she wouldn’t say it. If there was some other factor, she may not even be aware of it. It’s more unconscious. Trust. You increase trust by increasing communication. But how do you increase communication with somebody without coming across as over-the-top? Maybe over-the-top would have been preferable to the bi-weekly texter…
 
She tells me she needs a month to get it ready to list. She finds a new realtor somewhere between week 1 and week 3. I could have called last week. I don’t call. I could have called ever. I could send her listings as they come on market. I could send them the digital pdf version of the report. I could increase the fear and tension rather than putting them at ease. How? By increasing motivation to list sooner because of market conditions worsening. Because of buyers disappearing and becoming more particular as time goes by.
 
The fact of the matter is, she felt no problem with taking another realtor over me and not letting me know. She didn’t care about letting me know because what I was delivering was a commodity service. There was no real relationship there. Nothing to speak of. Now, whether or not this is somebody that you would get lunch with, this is somebody that’s in the market to sell a $400k home. Transactional. She found you (number one) on her own, but then when push came to shove she preferred a referral from a friend of hers who’d just had a positive experience with someone else. You should use your referrals and Success Stories more in your listing presentations.
 
You could ask people who you’ve just helped if they know anyone who’s thinking of buying or selling in the next few months. Other agents do this, and this is part of the reason why they find themselves in these situations and you don’t. You have to learn how to ask for the referral.
 
Pay attention to who gets this listing. Irrespective, note that this is something that you do not know how to do and need to learn how to do. This is a weakness of yours, not a quality of your character.
 
Now don’t beat yourself up. God wants you to learn. Like Yoda said last night, “The greatest teacher, failure is.” Use it.

That’s a good example. I was able to uncover some ideas and insight that I wouldn’t have otherwise. Furthermore, I felt somewhat better after I wrote this out. I put my arms around it, identified where I fell short, and committed to not making those same mistakes twice. To me, this is the work of a pro. We all make mistakes. The question is whether or not we learn from them.

The Autopsy Report

Top Contacts

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This is something I’ve yet to perfect but I have a belief in it because of how many people have instructed me to do it or something similar to it.

As a real estate professional, I’m in the people business, much as I hate to admit it. See, I don’t hate people, no not at all. But I don’t particularly love having to interact with them for my work.

I’m what is frequently referred to as an introvert. But, I get along well enough with others, so I’m moderately successful at real estate sales. This doesn’t help me though when it comes to spontaneously reaching out to everyone I know so I can be top of mind.

Yes, it’s not something I’ve been doing well lately. We participated in a coaching program earlier this year with Workman Success Systems and this is one concept they’re known for.

I identify my top contacts. This might be 250, 100, 50, or somewhere in between. The working notion here is that these people are the people most likely to refer me business. From here, I design a contact plan of how I want to keep in touch with them. At WSS, it was as simple as a phone call or a face-to-face meeting once per month.

A book that influenced me a lot earlier on is 7L – Seven Levels of Communication.1 Strongly recommend it. I may reread it now that I’m thinking about it. I could use some motivation around this.

The premise of the book is that trust comes as a byproduct of communication. When we communicate with people more and more, they trust us as professionals and become more and more likely to refer business to us.

So, how do we keep in touch with these people? WSS keeps it simple with a phone call or a face-to-face once per month.2 7L provides lots of ideas, an example of one is their emphasis on writing personal notes.3

7L also prescribes the task of grading one’s database. WSS had a similar suggestion. Most people think in terms of A, B, C, and sometimes D, and F. The point is that if I grade them, I don’t have to remember who’s at what stage, I just search for the categorical letter and see the list of people.

WSS used A is for leads that are expected to buy/sell/etc. within 30 days, for instance, whereas, A+ is an Ambassador in 7L — somebody who has before, and you expect to in the future, refer you more than 1 deal per year. Typically A (or A+) is the optimal grading, and people less likely to close or less likely to refer us business (depending on which model is used) would be graded as B, C, D, F, etc.

Some people make their entire careers just focused on direct referral. In order to do that, we have to be referrable. In order to be referrable, we have to behave remarkably when we’re dealing with clients.

Old Sam doesn’t always deal remarkably with clients. We all make mistakes. The important thing is to actually do our best so we can lay our head on the pillow peacefully, and so we can ensure that we’re going to be talked about positively by the people we’ve helped.

When it comes to this aspect of the business, we’re rewarded for being good at relationships. I sometimes feel that the effort makes it insincere, inauthentic. I have an angle, after all. So, I’m going to challenge myself to find a way to do it authentically for me.

Writing comes much easier to me. I could finally get serious about a work-related blog and send content out to my people once a month, once a week, bi-weekly, whatever. I could call the ones that I feel comfortable calling because I like them and they seem to like me.

Another way I could increase my SOI activity is by visiting people. I’m always so busy like every other real estate professional claims to be. 4 Getting out, intentionally, and visiting with past clients and friends in the area where I work is much more up my alley than the phone call. The visit, as opposed to the call, feels more meaningful for them, and it’s more fulfilling for me.

So, there I go! Win/win.

  • Begin a blog for my company and email the post however often I decide.
    • I’ll begin with a monthly newsletter with a market update and whatever other ancillary things that matter that I can think of.
    • I’ll post that as a blog post on our company website.
    • Maybe I’ll read the market report to a video screen and call it a YouTube video.
    • I’ll link both in our MailChimp account and send them out monthly to our subscribers.5
  • I’ll challenge myself to visit with one past client/member of my sphere of influence (SOI) every week.

For me, this feels both authentic and effective. It’s something I can get behind doing because it suits my personality and preferences more. Many people I know don’t mind making phone calls—it comes easily for them. Great. I think the important thing is mapping out a system and actually executing it for an extended period of time.6

  1. I’m a guy who’s had a considerable amount of my business come from people I know personally and from direct referrals from people I know personally. I believe this is due in large part to this book and the things it teaches. ↩︎
  2. I merely skimmed the Ninja real estate book you may have heard of. One concept that jumped out at me was this one. Very similar, they recommend a call every seven weeks to set up a meeting every eight weeks. Something like that. The approach is altered slightly everywhere but is otherwise ubiquitous. ↩︎
  3. Writing personal notes can be an effective and touching way to communicate. It feels very personal to see someone’s handwriting. A good rule of thumb with this would be to commit to writing X per day. In the 7L book, there’s an in-depth formula for how to write the cards. Use the formula if it’s helpful. If it deters you from writing them, it’s not serving you and you should just write notes. ↩︎
  4. But I’m rarely too busy for lunch with my business partner at the drop of a hat. ↩︎
  5. This will be distinct from the newsletter we’re already sending out, for this will actually be news! ↩︎
  6. Holiday cards, thank you notes, thinking of you notes, blogging, phone calls, client events, visiting them at their home, inviting them to visit you at your office or an open house, getting lunch/meals, play dates with their kids and yours, birthday parties, housewarming parties—the list goes on. ↩︎
Top Contacts

Did I mention follow up?

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There’s a guy who I’ve been calling every week for a while. What’s most surprising to me is that he’s never once been like, “Why are you calling me every week?”. It’s always been a little update even when he’s really saying nothing new.

I’d love to say that I’m just that diligent. I’m not. My client is. I have a buyer client that I represent only in this purchase (which may never happen), and he sends me a gentle text every week on the day that I say I’ll follow up with the seller again.

This began as an invitation to list the property. It’s an 11-unit apartment building in a small town near where I live. I prepared a market analysis without having seen the units, just to give him a down-and-dirty estimate of the value to begin with.

He went cold after we went back and forth a couple of times. I kept on him a bit but my spirits were flagging after about a month or two of checking in.

Then I met Mr. Buyer. He reached out to me cold after finding me on LoopNet, asking if I had any buildings like this one. I told him that I might have a listing coming on with 11 units in it and that it sounds like it would fit what he was looking for quite well actually.

Now I get to call the seller with a purpose! I have a buyer. He listened, intrigued, and asked if this guy had mailed him. He was fascinated that people actually wanted to buy buildings like this now (it had been owned by his LLC and others he owned and partnered on since the late ’70s).

Then he abruptly ended the conversation by saying something similar to “uh-huh, right, right, right, okay. Okay. Good. Sounds good. Good. Yup. See ya later. Bye,” all in fairly quick succession without me saying anything other than “bye” at the end. It’s one way to end a conversation. (It’s also the way he ends every phone conversation, I’ve since learned.)

Fast forward a week. I call again. Little update. Has some other buyers who might be interested (that mailed him last year and who he called). Okay.

My guy decided to submit an offer. Now he’s contractually my guy (on this place anyway). Seller invites me over to see the units. Things are looking promising.

I look at the units. I offer feedback. I inquire about the offer. They express interest but nothing concrete. Still thinking about it.

Another week. I call. Similar thing. The other buyer is working on getting more buyers to partner. Still interested in our offer (but it’s low), just want to see how much they can get for it. Don’t want to expose it to the market because then the tenants will know. That could be messy.

Okay. Next week. I call again.

Gotten keys from some of the units. Many of them are nicer than the ones I saw in person. There’s a lot of potential here. Do I have any idea about building code in this town as it relates to second form of egress? No? Okay. Still thinking about it. Buyers are still trying to find other partners. Bye.

This went on and has gone on now for five months, maybe six?

Every week, I put a new task in my calendar to call this guy. Every week, my client texts me and asks for an update.

Today was that day of the week. I called. Voicemail. I had a challenging day today (as well as yesterday). It’s the end of my day. He calls back. I answer. One of the first things he says is he asks me what the listing fee is. I know where this is going! I answer adeptly and I explain that that includes buyer agency as well. He asks a clarifying question. I explain. Finally! I’ve been at this stupid thing altogether since January (August 29th today), and calling weekly for close to four or five months. I’ve had a tough couple days baby, but this is going to make it all worth it!

He next asks if I know why his buyers backed out.

I say that I don’t. He explains various things regarding the width of one of the stairwells, that there’s a support beam too close to a header and they’ve taken water there before, and something he wasn’t sure about concerning the foundation.

I listen and make understanding noises as he talks.

After 10 minutes of this, he says they still have a lot to think about. He makes no committal indications of anything.

Well, it would have been nice…

What did I do? Cry into my keyboard and wish that my fucking day would lighten just a little bit?

I set the reminder to call him next week.

Did I mention follow up?